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Study Group: Theosophy: Chapter I
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maggieinnh
Site Admin
Joined: Fri Oct 26, 2007 3:56 am Posts: 609 Location: New England, USA
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 Comment on -comment on last two or three paragraphs
Thank you ladies! I guess I was right to a certain extent than..., this is definitely a different angle on the evolution theory, but makes sense in connection to the previous texts that we have read from Steiner.
Quote: I think when we finish with Theosophy (5 years or so), we could study "Man as Symphony of the Creative Word" (not sure of the title). I hope it will not take us this long Deborah,  but that title sounds interesting! Quote: I'm really enjoying working in this way, with this text.
I know it is fun, isn't it! This makes learning enjoyable. 
_________________ "The difference between 'involvement' and 'commitment' is like an eggs-and-ham breakfast: the chicken was 'involved' - the pig was 'committed'."
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| Sat Feb 09, 2008 4:31 am |
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maggieinnh
Site Admin
Joined: Fri Oct 26, 2007 3:56 am Posts: 609 Location: New England, USA
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 Chapter I: 4. The Body, Soul and Spirit
The first three paragraphs:
Humans can only truly understand themselves when they consider the significance of their thinking being.
The brain in the human body is considered as the "...bodily basis for the thinking spirit", the eye perceives the outer world and the brain, which serve as the thinking tool to process all the external influences, are located at the very same point.
The brain in the human is his largest organ in comparison with the rest of his body.
Many people place a higher value on the feelings and emotions rather than on the thought of man and consider them as the most important gift to humanity. For ordinary thinking processes this might be true, but in the case of higher thoughts the opposite applies. The thoughts that are required and refer to the higher world are not those that happen on their own account, but require the energy and perseverance of the clear thought.
The human body is constructed to adapt to thinking, the same forces that one can find in the mineral kingdom are combined in the human body to manifest itself as thought. This structure in accordance with its function is the physical body of man.
Next paragraph: "Organized with reference to the brain as its central point, this mineral structure..."
_________________ "The difference between 'involvement' and 'commitment' is like an eggs-and-ham breakfast: the chicken was 'involved' - the pig was 'committed'."
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| Mon Feb 11, 2008 3:30 am |
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Henitsirk
Crunchy
Joined: Thu Nov 01, 2007 2:54 am Posts: 147 Location: Pocatello, Idaho
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Sorry again--I'm still not receiving email updates, so I am having a hard time remembering to check for my turn. Guess I need to do some supplemental exercises again!
The physical body originates in reproduction and matures through growth -- these forces humans have in common with plants and animals, because they signify a living being as opposed to a solely mineral substance.
Minerals are formed by the physical laws that govern their constituent substances, e.g., the crystal formations of silicon, iron, etc. Living beings, on the other hand, are formed from the reproductive cells of the parents--thus, the form of a species is maintained and transmitted through heredity, even though the substance of which it is made changes over time. (I assume this is like the concept that we regenerate our body cells every seven years?) The species-determining force can be called the life force.
Therefore, while the mineral is shaped by its substance, the substance of the living being is shaped by its species.
Next paragraph: "The mineral forces are perceived by man by means of his bodily senses..."
_________________ http://anthromama.wordpress.com
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| Thu Feb 14, 2008 3:01 am |
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Deborah
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Joined: Mon Oct 29, 2007 5:13 pm Posts: 170
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The next paragraph is extremely long and includes a very long footnote on the subject of terminology: etheric body versus formative-force body. I'm not going to deal with the footnote--just read it and if you have questions let us know!
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We can perceive mineral structures with our bodily senses--light with eyes, sound with ears, touch with our body surface (nerves). The simplest organisms have a very basic sense of touch, but the rest of what humans can perceive doesn't exist for such creatures. Steiner uses this fact to build a picture of a path to even broader perception through the development of higher senses, specifically in this case the ability to perceive life-forces. Also called the ether body.
The ether body is not the result of the combining of physical matter and physical forces but the reverse, this body brings to life the physical matter and also organizes and directs its development. When the life forces depart the form begins to fall apart. (Pull up a weed and let it lie there for a little while, you can literally see the formative forces begin to depart.) The seer can perceive this life body directly.
The human ether body differs from the ether body of a plant and from the ether body of an animal, because its purpose is connected to our ability to think.
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Whew!
Next paragraph begins:
The life-body is still something external to man.
Henitsirk, do you have the "notify me when a reply is posted" box checked? It is visible below the writing box when you are in Post a Reply mode.
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| Thu Feb 14, 2008 11:21 pm |
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Henitsirk
Crunchy
Joined: Thu Nov 01, 2007 2:54 am Posts: 147 Location: Pocatello, Idaho
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Deborah wrote: Henitsirk, do you have the "notify me when a reply is posted" box checked? It is visible below the writing box when you are in Post a Reply mode.
I do. It was something wonky with just this thread, I think. But I did toggle the email notification setting in my profile today, and lo and behold, I received an email about this post! Hopefully I can keep away from that "unwatch" link in my emails from now on.
_________________ http://anthromama.wordpress.com
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| Fri Feb 15, 2008 1:26 am |
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maggieinnh
Site Admin
Joined: Fri Oct 26, 2007 3:56 am Posts: 609 Location: New England, USA
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Henitsirk wrote: Deborah wrote: Henitsirk, do you have the "notify me when a reply is posted" box checked? It is visible below the writing box when you are in Post a Reply mode. I do. It was something wonky with just this thread, I think. But I did toggle the email notification setting in my profile today, and lo and behold, I received an email about this post! Hopefully I can keep away from that "unwatch" link in my emails from now on.

_________________ "The difference between 'involvement' and 'commitment' is like an eggs-and-ham breakfast: the chicken was 'involved' - the pig was 'committed'."
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| Fri Feb 15, 2008 2:16 am |
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maggieinnh
Site Admin
Joined: Fri Oct 26, 2007 3:56 am Posts: 609 Location: New England, USA
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With the first experiences of sensation the inner self responds to stimuli of the outer world during which the chemical process of transforming the external stimuli into inner experiences takes place. The ether body is observing the physical brain process being transformed into a life- process. Whatever a human is experiencing is unique to that person, everybody perceives objects and acts differently from each other, therefore the ether body of each human is different. Without this activity in humans we would only have a life- process similar to plants. Man receives constant external impressions, which in turn has all kinds of sensations aroused in man in response to the stimuli. This activity is called the "sentient soul" of man.
Man only senses impressions of the external world, but beholds of the sensations themselves, man must distinguish between one owns sensational experience and that of another person. Every human can see into his own sensation world but only a seer can view the sensation of another man. A normal person experiences the sensation world as an inner world with the experiences of his own soul. With this soul man can see "the outward-turned spiritual gaze what otherwise lives only in the inner nature of another being."
Next paragraph begins with: "In order to prevent misunderstanding, it may be expressly stated..."
_________________ "The difference between 'involvement' and 'commitment' is like an eggs-and-ham breakfast: the chicken was 'involved' - the pig was 'committed'."
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| Sat Feb 16, 2008 3:17 am |
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Henitsirk
Crunchy
Joined: Thu Nov 01, 2007 2:54 am Posts: 147 Location: Pocatello, Idaho
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Though the seer can perceive another person's experience of sensation, he/she does not experience the content of the other person's experience him/herself. The seer only perceives a manifestation of it.
The sentient soul depends on the ether body to create sensations, and is limited by the proper functioning of the ether and physical bodies, though the limit of the sentient soul is greater than the physical body.
Between the physical and ether bodies on the one hand, and the sentient soul on the other, exists the soul or sentient (astral) body. One could say that the finer element of the ether body unites with the sentient soul, and its coarser element unites with the physical body.
In addition to sensation, the soul nature also includes desires, aversions, instincts, etc., which are all also dependent on the physical and ether bodies.
Next paragraph: "The sentient soul enters into mutual action and reaction with the body..."
_________________ http://anthromama.wordpress.com
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| Thu Feb 21, 2008 4:11 am |
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Deborah
Moderator
Joined: Mon Oct 29, 2007 5:13 pm Posts: 170
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The sentient soul connects to the body and to the spirit. As human beings learn to think, first they think for the immediate benefit of their feeling life, and much of our thinking continues to operate in that way: most technology serves the interests of our sentient aspect. The parallel activity of the life force permeating the physical body and the thought activity permeating the sentient body in each case moves something lower, higher. The physical body comes to life, the sentient soul moves into a world of laws based on thought. The higher part of our soul which has developed beyond the immediate service of needs can be called the mind or intellectual soul.
From the seer's viewpoint, the mind soul is visible as a separate form within the sentient soul.
Next paragraph begins: By thinking, the human being is led above and beyond his own personal life.
I'm very sorry it took me so long to do the next paragraph!
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| Tue Feb 26, 2008 3:09 pm |
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maggieinnh
Site Admin
Joined: Fri Oct 26, 2007 3:56 am Posts: 609 Location: New England, USA
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Do not worry Deborah!
We are also a bit off lately with our plans and time as you can probably guess, otherwise I would have worked on more paragraphs.
Winter is starting to get to me,.... I need sun and spring! Fat chance with more snow on the way.
Through the thought process and his search for truth man goes beyond his personal life and soul, so he can relate to the outer world, through which he gets to know his own nature.
As an example Steiner speaks of the night sky, which brings joy to him as it does to the person next to him, but the momentary thought process about that joy might not occur to everybody at the same time although the existence of the knowledge of that joy is ever present.
If the knowledge of the heavens gives him joy, the joy is only of importance as long as it is thought of, but the truth of that knowledge is significant independently of his joy.
Next paragraph:"By grasping the truth, the soul connects itself ..."
_________________ "The difference between 'involvement' and 'commitment' is like an eggs-and-ham breakfast: the chicken was 'involved' - the pig was 'committed'."
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| Thu Feb 28, 2008 3:06 am |
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Henitsirk
Crunchy
Joined: Thu Nov 01, 2007 2:54 am Posts: 147 Location: Pocatello, Idaho
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My whole family has been sick, and after I post this I am going to bed! I can't wait for warmer weather....
The value of truth does not pass away even when our feelings toward it change. Our conceptions of truth may change over time, but they are always manifestations of something eternal. Truth acquires its value and significance independently of humans, and therefore is a unique goal for human striving.
Next para: "As it is with the true..."
(Sorry to be so short. I really feel icky, but I didn't want to completely drop the ball here.  )
_________________ http://anthromama.wordpress.com
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| Thu Mar 06, 2008 4:34 am |
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Deborah
Moderator
Joined: Mon Oct 29, 2007 5:13 pm Posts: 170
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Morality parallels truth in its reality. What is right is independent of our feelings and personal inclinations. By working on ourselves we can transform our likes and dislikes. Through this transformation we can become human beings whose desires and moral inclinations will flow together instead of duty pulling us one way and moral right tugging the other.
Next paragraph begins: By causing the self-existent true and good to come to life in his inner being,
[trying to overcome my desire for chocolate chip cookies, which does not always coincide with the higher truth. ]
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| Fri Mar 07, 2008 2:06 am |
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maggieinnh
Site Admin
Joined: Fri Oct 26, 2007 3:56 am Posts: 609 Location: New England, USA
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Mans immortal striving for truth raises himself above the sentient soul, and brings forth the consciousness soul. the meaning of consciousness soul here is not a merely ordinary sensation, but is separate from the intellectual soul, which is connected to sensations and impulses.
Only the truth that is free of sympathy and antipathy can be called permanent truth, even if ones personal feelings revolt against it. This part of the soul that allows such a recognition is called consciousness soul.
The sentient soul, intellectual soul and the consciousness soul distinguishes mans soul as a whole. The more a soul fills itself with the true and good, the more expansive becomes the eternal in it. A seer recognizes this eternal expansion as much as the light of a flame.
Next paragraph begins with: "For the seer, the corporeal man counts as only..."
_________________ "The difference between 'involvement' and 'commitment' is like an eggs-and-ham breakfast: the chicken was 'involved' - the pig was 'committed'."
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| Tue Mar 11, 2008 2:09 am |
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maggieinnh
Site Admin
Joined: Fri Oct 26, 2007 3:56 am Posts: 609 Location: New England, USA
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The seer can perceive the corporal body of man as only a small part of his humanity. The ether body fills the physical body as a life-form, the soul body (astral shape) extends beyond these onto all sides into the sentient soul and the intellectual soul which grows larger the more of the good and true it receives into itself. A man who only lives to his own pleasures limits his intellectual soul to those of his sentient soul. These structures can be called the human aura, which indicate the enrichment of man's soul nature.
Next paragraph:" In the course of his development as a child, there comes a moment...."
- Ladies,
I think we bit off more than we can chew with this study! We are all too busy with our lives and things that need to be done, or maybe it's just bad timing, ...I am not sure?
We should maybe work with smaller articles and lectures for right now until we find more interest among other board members who would like to take part in such an endeavor as Theosophy.
We could probably get back to this at a time when we have more participants than just the three of us. What do you think?
Should we finish this chapter and than look for something smaller again?
Maggie
_________________ "The difference between 'involvement' and 'commitment' is like an eggs-and-ham breakfast: the chicken was 'involved' - the pig was 'committed'."
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| Tue Mar 18, 2008 7:29 pm |
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Deborah
Moderator
Joined: Mon Oct 29, 2007 5:13 pm Posts: 170
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Good idea to finish this chapter. I'll do the next couple of paragraphs right now, to keep things moving along.
There is a hugely important moment in the life of a child when he/she becomes aware of themselves as an I. (Here Steiner quotes such an account). When children first learn to speak they call themselves by name, but at some point they become aware of their "independent existence" and begin to say "I".
We experience our interplay with the world. We can see and touch our own body, we are aware of our soul through sensations and emotions, when we act on the world we experience our will, but our individual essence, our "I" cannot be experienced except in the most inward way. It is our true essence. As we become more self-aware, we may see our other aspects as tools of the "I". Another clue to the nature of this essential core of the human being is the use of the word "I". We can only use this word of ourselves, not of anyone else or anything else in the world.
Next paragraph begins: This also expresses itself in the aura
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| Thu Mar 20, 2008 9:22 pm |
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